Seeking (more) Advice

[pacman]

As most of you know, and have discussed with me already, I have received and accepted a four year ROTC Scholarship to NC State University, starting August. I thought I was sure, but some questions have arose this past week. I was at Appalachian State visiting their Battalion, and 70% of their Cadets are NG SMP. Obviously, they heavily encourage the SMP route and actually advised me to decline my scholarship. I was baffled by this at first, but I spoke with alot of their cadre at great lengths discussing this option.

A few things really appeal to me about SMP. I have always had an issue with being an officer without enlisted experience, my logic just says this is not a good recipe. I would prefer to have been there, done that before I assume command over men. Another thing is, I would love to go through basic and AIT, just like everyone else I will be in charge of. I think the experience gained would allow me to make much more informed decisions down the road, and the other plus is that my SMP time will count towards retirement.

Now for the cons, my common sense tells me that turning down a full ride is idiotic. I already have been blessed with this, why say no? The bottom line is that the SMP route will not be as much money for school, and the drill pay will not match my stipend.

Is the experience worth less school money and pay? At this point I am just considering this option, but I think that it does offer some great things to a future officer. I would also like to know if it would be possible to get Airborne in a contract before I start school, because this would seal the deal for me, knowing I was headed there. Anyone have an opinion? Would I be an idiot to do this, or is it a decent option? Thanks in advance.

[Para-327th]

I worked with plenty of good and a few great LTs that hadn't been prior enlisted. The simple fact that you think you'd be better officer if you served enlisted first already puts you ahead of the few bad LTs I ran across. Just my .02 cents.

[CharliePC]

my common sense tells me that turning down a full ride is idiotic. I already have been blessed with this, why say no? The bottom line is that the SMP route will not be as much money for school, and the drill pay will not match my stipend.

You're already on the right road... drive on. Listen to your common sense.

[Bell]

You got a lot of stuff in there dude. Explain SMP to me. I'll tell ya what to do.

I like your mindset already. Even if you don't do the basic soldier routine you're already your thinking of your troops.

Explain to me.

[Ops NCO]

Personally, I wouldn't turn down a full ride. There's a lot to be said for having a degree and no loans for 20 years.

[Rocket1972]

Personally, I wouldn't turn down a full ride. There's a lot to be said for having a degree and no loans for 20 years.

Agree 100%. If I had it all to do again this would be my path. Don't be a knucklehead and turn down the free ride.

[pacman]

You got a lot of stuff in there dude. Explain SMP to me. I'll tell ya what to do.

I like your mindset already. Even if you don't do the basic soldier routine you're already your thinking of your troops.

Explain to me.

Ranger Bell,
SMP= Simultaneous Membership Program. It means I would head to basic/AIT this summer, hook up with a NG or another Reserve component and drill with them along with doing ROTC. SMP lets the cadets access the GI Bill for tuition/books, and then drill pay of around $250 is added. They said they can also "guarantee Air-Assault school" but I don't know about that. The real plus is the experience gained, and the four years towards retirement because the GI Bill is not going to cover all of my tuition, and the $250 drill pay is significantly less than my ROTC stipend.

To the others, thank you for confirming my notion that turning down a scholarship was a bad idea, I think I will stick to my original plan. As I said before, I was just wanting to make sure I was not sacrificing some sort of opportunity that would significantly enhance my ability as LT, just for a bit more financial stability. Thanks for the input.

[PIKE]

70% of their Cadets are NG SMP. Obviously, they heavily encourage the SMP route

I think this is because they did not have

a four year ROTC Scholarship to NC State University

or all/most of them would have gone that route. I say go to NC State, and this is coming from a BIG UNC fan.lol

[Italyjumper1]

Take the full ride!!!! You will get plenty of experience through ROTC, mil schooling, and your first duty station.

[Santo Tomas]

As most of you know, and have discussed with me already, I have received and accepted a four year ROTC Scholarship to NC State University, starting August. I thought I was sure, but some questions have arose this past week. I was at Appalachian State visiting their Battalion, and 70% of their Cadets are NG SMP. Obviously, they heavily encourage the SMP route and actually advised me to decline my scholarship. I was baffled by this at first, but I spoke with alot of their cadre at great lengths discussing this option. OF course they do, saves money.

A few things really appeal to me about SMP. I have always had an issue with being an officer without enlisted experience, my logic just says this is not a good recipe. I would prefer to have been there, done that before I assume command over men. Another thing is, I would love to go through basic and AIT, just like everyone else I will be in charge of. I think the experience gained would allow me to make much more informed decisions down the road, and the other plus is that my SMP time will count towards retirement. Might have been like that in the past but not now. My son turned down his scholarship and went SMP. IMO, not worth it.

Now for the cons, my common sense tells me that turning down a full ride is idiotic. I already have been blessed with this, why say no? The bottom line is that the SMP route will not be as much money for school, and the drill pay will not match my stipend. YOur right, it's idiotic.

Is the experience worth less school money and pay? At this point I am just considering this option, but I think that it does offer some great things to a future officer. I would also like to know if it would be possible to get Airborne in a contract before I start school, because this would seal the deal for me, knowing I was headed there. Anyone have an opinion? Would I be an idiot to do this, or is it a decent option? Thanks in advance.

IMO stay with the scholarship.

[pacman]

IMO stay with the scholarship.

Much appreciated Santo, I haven't heard from anyone who has seen this situation firsthand as was not totally biased towards SMP. Done deal, I am writing that option off.

[old grunt]

Ditto on CharliePC and IT1's advice. TAKE the full ride...you'll get all the fun stuff down the line.

[Bell]

You're on the right track. Take the scholarship!! You'll gain experience on the job.

Our CC always cleaned his weapon with us after a mission. Everyone sitting there sipping beer, shooting the shit, cleaning weapons, all in tshirts with cammy still on. Good times.

[zanshin]

Go to school on scholarship, join the PRs or something if you want more involvement during school, and work at becoming an educated, intelligent leader.

Forget that going through Basic & AIT "just like everyone else I will be in charge of" nonsense. Reason: if you're not gonna be a Cook, why would you go to Cook school?

Your officers course branch training will be the appropriate and necessary training geared to your duties in the military. BCT and AIT are designed to turning a raw civilian into an enlisted-level soldier. In my opinion (and I went through Basic and Infantry AIT/OSUT on two separate occasions, so I've got an idea of what it is), it's low-level skill repetition primarily keyed to teaching a soldier specific tasks, and to follow explicit instructions, to obey orders of all superiors, and to replace individuality with team-oriented thinking. This isn't what an Officer gets paid to do, so you learning to do it is a waste of your time, the Army's time, and the taxpayers' money.

About the only advantage being an enlisted man in the Guard provides an officer is to give you a better idea of how much they're trying to get over on you. It's not like you're gonna be a combat veteran NCO with years of experience who then becomes an Officer and does a better job as a leader. If you believe you need better insight to what the enlisted men you lead are thinking, ask your PSG and Team Leaders. That's what they get paid for.

I'm not saying empathy for your assigned enlisted men is a waste of time. A good leader knows his troops capabilities and shortcomings. But you don't have to experience 6 months being their barracks buddies to properly evaluate their performance and initiate positive performance training and execution. You want buddies to commiserate with, get your bars and go to Ranger school. You'll get a truly marvelous shared experience.

Best of luck in college!

[Dark Star]

Here is how you can, not absolutely will, get fucked either way:

SMP - say you do this, and end up taking a GFRD scholarship. Have fun in the Reserve or Guard and NEVER going active duty.

Full Ride (Good job, BTW! These are RARE nowadays) - Go ahead, get kicked out (for ANY REASON like failing an APFT, or being a general shitbag) This is the closest thing to getting drafted. Basically, you get discharged from ROTC and (maybe) given the choice, pay back the scholarship or do a couple years in the Regular Army. If you end up getting orders to go active, you report to a recruiting station and we build just enough data to ship you out, not a full enlistment packet, because you're already in for whatever the Army wants!

Otherwise, good luck.